3G 6010 full penetration welds, I can't do, and I'm running out of plate!

[GaveUpOnTV]

I'm taking welding at school. My teacher has shown me how to weld vertical w/6010, but I still can't get the hang of it. I know that I have to have that 'snorkel' or 'echo' sound-I think I know that the rod angle should be pretty flat or perhaps somewhat tilted up in direction of weld. I've seen multiple videos of people welding up, slowly moving the keyhole up. I can't seem to duplicate the results, except in very limited (3/4 to 1 inch) distances.
How much 'snorkeling' sound should there be? Should it be maximized? I think the electrode end should be a little short of the land this makes it 'snorkel' quieter, and the sounds sometimes fades slightly as the electrode fluctuates around the beginning of the land area. I"m using (now) Lincoln 5P+, and when I stopped yesterday it was about 100 amps, and I had tried the lower amperage's from about 75 amps up (using 1/8" electrodes) to 100 amps.
I think a written description might help me.
Some videos seem to show the person going in a forward and back motion (short arc, and seems about start of land area. They just go forward and back (maybe half?) and slowly move the keyhole up. Others seem to include the round hole itself.
What I'm getting is excess weld on both sides of the plate. The weld is rolling and drooping down on both sides.
I"ve only got a few plates left and don't seem to be making progress at all. I'm at home with my personal welder (invertor w/ 6010 port) and I'm just ruining material.
Maybe if I had a 'target' to shoot for, like should the electrode end be right at the beginning of land, and using the forward and back motion? I also end up with a huge holes, maybe size of a nickel or a little smaller, when I reach the top of plate and don't have any more material above to melt down to move the keyhole up.
Also I could use a description of how to do a full penetration weld (everything the same as above but horizontal (2G). Of course my first description is for 3G.
Thanks for any help!

I'm using a PowerArc 300

[performance]

Pictures would help.
Turn down your arc force a little. And push in. You don't say what thickness plate, joint prep etc. you are doing.

[GaveUpOnTV]

The plates are starting at 3/8" and go up to 1/2". They have a combined angle of 70 or 75 degrees. The plates are apart 1/8". I'm grinding the lands to about 1/8" each.
Maybe I'm going too hot. Next time I'll try maybe around 65-70 amps for the 3/8" plate (with 1/8" 6010 electrodes) I believe last time I started at 75 and went up from there.
Is the idea to barely have the 'whoosh' or echoing going? If it's at a maximum noise level, the end of the electrode is past the back of the plate. I'm thinking that the end of electrode should be around the beginning of the land at a maximum depth, and maybe a 1/16 or 1/8 before it.

[performance]

70-75 degrees is a little much for many tests. I'd look at 60 or 65 degrees. Also a root gap of 3/32" and land of about the same. The higher you go, the more heat that builds in the plate since heat rises and the more likely it is you will burn holes. Start a little low and use your arc force to keep the heat in the puddle and create your key hole. But some people think that a key hole is supposed to be large and visible. It really isn't. The hole should just start to oval out when you step forward(whip). I am not sure what you are referring to about the end of the electrode being past the back of the plate vs. beginning of the land at maximum depth.

[GaveUpOnTV]

I finally am getting some good results. It's because I had the amperage too high. It seems to be working well with around 67-69 amps with the 6010.

[geezer]

that is a bit low on the amps,,,which means that you were traveling too slow to begin with,,,lowering the amps to get better results is not the answer but it does show what the problem is,,,,as you get better/more practise,,,the amps will increase and so will your speed...congrats on the improvement..

[performance]

Geezer,
With 6010 and an inverter with arc force control, it is not. I've run them about there myself with XMT's.

[geezer]

Geezer,
With 6010 and an inverter with arc force control, it is not. I've run them about there myself with XMT's.

Not to argue about arc force control and it's effects in conjuction with amps,,,to me...there are 3 kinds of keyhole on up hill welding,,,the first being a slit trench with indications of a keyhole starting to form at the head of the weld puddle,,,the second is a fully formed keyhole,,,and third is a keyhole enlarged....regardless of the amps involved...rod movement is the main factor that can make or break the weld success...IMO traveling along just as the keyhole starts to form ahead of the weld puddle is about right,,,if you try to move with a perfect keyhole shape ahead of the weld puddle you run the risk of an enlarged keyhole...once you have an enlarged keyhole your first response is to slowdown and fill the hole,,,that just complicates the problem by adding more heat to a hole and gives a blow through....
reducing amps is one way of slowing the process of keyhole formation and gives the operator a chance to move a head at a slower pace,,,,as a person gets better he will eventually up the amps and travel faster,,,,that was my point,,,

[Angus]

Great info on this post. I am a beginner and started welding 3/32 6011s at 85 amps and I was getting rods that would turn into toast! I lowered the amps to about 60-65 amps and things seem to run a bit smoother. 1/8 6011s ran great at 70 amps. Im welding with a PowerArc200ST.

[edprocoat]

Great info on this post. I am a beginner and started welding 3/32 6011s at 85 amps and I was getting rods that would turn into toast! I lowered the amps to about 60-65 amps and things seem to run a bit smoother. 1/8 6011s ran great at 70 amps. Im welding with a PowerArc200ST.

I have a new PowerArx200ST too and I have been burning 6010 1/8's at 68 amps with no problems. It cergtainly seems to run hotter than anything else I have ever used.

ed

[TheGary]

In my experience each welding machine and operator all have different feel and run a rod different. Run it where it works the best for you andthat will be way different when you change to a different machine. If you have good control and get good results at 67 amps that were I would keep it. A weld test will prove weather it is a good weld . I can tell if one of my welds will pass a test before it is even tested. You will to once you get some practice.

[LincTex]

I always weld downhill with 6010/6011 for the root pass, and uphill with 7018 for the cap.

[weldmate]

There are a variety of welding tools and a variety of methods by which welding can be done. each welding style requires different techniques and tools that are necessary. hence it is necessary that you understand your need(technique and tools) before welding. adjust the output according to your needs and weld according to your heart's content.