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Thread: How to I use this Everlast torch.

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Judgeless How to I use this Everlast... 06-10-2014, 10:42 PM
Kempy I don't have a 210EXT but a... 06-10-2014, 11:20 PM
Judgeless I wonder how you get the... 06-11-2014, 01:39 AM
Rambozo Never seen that version of... 06-11-2014, 01:47 AM
performance I use the air cooled version... 06-11-2014, 02:22 AM
performance When you select do1 in... 06-11-2014, 02:40 AM
Judgeless I did that. I have it set in... 06-11-2014, 03:28 AM
performance Does the torch function in 2T... 06-11-2014, 03:53 AM
Judgeless When I use the pedal to... 06-11-2014, 03:58 AM
RichardH Judgeless, If you'd like to... 06-12-2014, 07:03 AM
Judgeless Performance I am sorry I did... 06-12-2014, 05:37 PM
Judgeless I answered that in post #10 ... 06-11-2014, 02:30 PM
performance Judgeless, Many of your... 06-11-2014, 04:42 PM
Judgeless I did answer that. I did not... 06-11-2014, 06:35 PM
performance 1) I am asking again to... 06-11-2014, 08:23 PM
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  1. Default How to I use this Everlast torch.

    I have an Everlast 210EXT and it came with a bonus AMP control torch. It shipped with the wrong gas connector. I finally took the time to buy a new connector and clamp so it works with the 210EXT.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I assume the best way to use it is 4T mode. I also assume when the variable knob is turned all the way up. You press the button and it starts the ARC, then when you release the button it runs the weld at target AMP setting. If you move the knob it turns down the AMP setting.

    On my 210EXT it will not let me select 4T mode when this torched is plugged in. It does let me select 4T with the default Everlast torch. If I changed the hidden menu (D8) to 1 it lets me select 4T.

    When I try to use the variable control it has zero effect. What is the best way to use this torch?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Canada, Suttonwest, Ontario
    Posts
    676

    Default

    I don't have a 210EXT but a 255EXT and it should be the same on T4 you only get to use the Amptrol up to what ever setting on amps you set on the machine. I set mine to max. then I have the complete range of amps. When you first start by pushing the start button once it will start the arc, then you can use the Amptrol up or down then push the start button again and it shuts off. Mine has to be in pedal and T4 at the same time to work both light are on. Like they say if all fails read the manual.
    Everlast PowerTig 325EXT (Canada)
    Everlast Power I Mig 250 (Canada)
    Everlast PowerPlasma 80S (Canada)
    Everlast PowerCool W300 (Canada)
    Everlast PowerMTS 250S Fitted with a 30A Spoolgun(Canada)
    Miller Dynasty 400 wireless(Canada)
    Millermatic 252 plus 30A Spoolgun(Canada)

  3. Default

    I wonder how you get the 210EXT in pedal and 4T mode? The torch did not come with a manual and the 201EXT manual covers very little.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Disneyland
    Posts
    2,662

    Default

    Never seen that version of torch before. IMHO it doesn't look all that ergonomic to use. The preview pictures were a totally different design.
    Long arc, short arc, heliarc and in-the-dark!

  5. #5

    Default

    I use the air cooled version of that torch with the 210EXT. It was/is the torch that comes with that version as an optional amp control. It works well. I used it welding upside down under a stainless running board of a 1 ton truck the other day, and was comfortable...would have been perfect if I had a stubby consumable kit like we sell but other than that, it was easy to get a grip on and use my outside fingers to roll on the power. I was using 2T mode as I was doing short welds and tacks to get the running boards back on the truck so they wouldn't "flap" around going down the road. The new 210EXT coming out soon and the current 255EXT has a pedal and a pedal 4T mode. Judgeless the unit you have does not.

  6. #6

    Default

    When you select do1 in program 8 of the background menu, it allows you to select the special 4T mode which allows you to ramp power up and down after the switch is released the first time and upslope has finished doing its thing. The range of control(welding amps) is set on the panel and the torch will control the amperage from the minimum set amperage up to the selected welding amperage.

  7. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by performance View Post
    When you select do1 in program 8 of the background menu, it allows you to select the special 4T mode which allows you to ramp power up and down after the switch is released the first time and upslope has finished doing its thing. The range of control(welding amps) is set on the panel and the torch will control the amperage from the minimum set amperage up to the selected welding amperage.
    I did that. I have it set in the hidden menu option 8 now to 1. It now lets me select 4T mode. It does not let me use the rolling knob to change the current. Do you think my 210EXT is bad for the torch Everlast sent me is bad?
    Last edited by Judgeless; 06-11-2014 at 03:43 AM.

  8. #8

    Default

    Does the torch function in 2T with the amp control? You should try it again. How are you using it exactly? How are you determining it is not working? What are your 4T settings? IIRC, it will not allow the torch to control the amps below the start (or end?) current? I'll have to check that aspect as I set it for low current for 4T starting/ending amps. If it allows you to set it to 4T with 01, that part is correct. But slope should block the current adjustment feature until it slopes up to the determined amp setting on the torch. There is a possibility too that the torch knob responds more slowly according to the slope setting. (Will have to test several settings, but the unit I have works with the knob in 4T.

  9. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by performance View Post
    Does the torch function in 2T with the amp control? You should try it again. How are you using it exactly? How are you determining it is not working?
    Everlast has a different view of 2T and 4T then I do. This is what I expect.

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    With 2T I would expect that I would have to hold the button the entire time and adjust the amps with another finger? Is that correct? This seems very difficult and I have not tried it.

    With 4T after I release the button I should be able to adjust the amps up or down using the rolling knob. Is this your view? It is not working on my unit.
    Last edited by Judgeless; 06-11-2014 at 04:33 AM.

  10. Default

    When I use the pedal to change the amperage it shows the current amperage on the 210EXT. When I use the knob it does not seem to change the amperage. Should it?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona, USA
    Posts
    85

    Default

    Judgeless,
    If you'd like to describe what you'd like tested, I can compare with my unit. I also got that torch. I use it, but with a foot pedal; based on behavior when I connect it to the control port, I'd expect it to behave as if it were a pedal, but I actually haven't tried the trigger & amp control on it.

    Regards,
    Richard
    210EXT (2013 USA)

  12. Default

    Performance I am sorry I did not get back quicker. I was out of town last night.

    I started from scratch today. Your question about using different torches changes the way the unit works made me try different options.

    With the gray torch 2T and 4T work well. If hidden menu D08 is set to1 I have more control. It adds up slope and down slope control using DC in T2 mode.

    With the pedal it works well. If hidden menu D08 is set to1 I have more control. It adds up slope and down slope control using DC in T2 mode.

    With the green variable torch 4T works now. I can use the knob to adjust the current. You can see it in the arc and on the display. I am not sure why it did not work before.

    With the green variable torch 2T does not work. The arc starts and runs for about 5 seconds. When the arc goes out, the 210EXT makes a clicking noise. When I try starting it again it runs for 2 seconds and starts clicking. Torch is turned all the way up and the unit is set for 100A.

    It is not a big deal because I do not think I would ever use 2T with the green torch variable option. I am curious on why it is doing that. Also is it a sign of something failing? Since most things are working would you still like for me to answer any of those questions?

  13. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveO View Post
    Posted in the interest of problem solving: a concise reprise of Mark's 7 questions. Please use these as a starting point.
    From post #8:
    ~ Does the torch function in 2T with the amp control?
    ~ How are you using it exactly?
    ~ How are you determining it is not working?
    ~ What are your 4T settings?
    ~ IIRC, it will not allow the torch to control the amps below the start (or end?) current?

    From post #11:
    ~ YOU have tried it while welding correct?
    ~ Don't look at the machine, look at the arc. Does the intensity change?
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveO View Post
    ~ Does the torch function in 2T with the amp control?
    I answered that in post #10

    Quote Originally Posted by Judgeless View Post
    With 2T I would expect that I would have to hold the button the entire time and adjust the amps with another finger? Is that correct? This seems very difficult and I have not tried it.
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveO View Post
    ~ How are you using it exactly?
    This was answered in my first post #1

    Quote Originally Posted by Judgeless View Post
    I assume the best way to use it is 4T mode. I also assume when the variable knob is turned all the way up. You press the button and it starts the ARC, then when you release the button it runs the weld at target AMP setting. If you move the knob it turns down the AMP setting.

    On my 210EXT it will not let me select 4T mode when this torched is plugged in. It does let me select 4T with the default Everlast torch. If I changed the hidden menu (D8) to 1 it lets me select 4T.
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveO View Post
    ~ How are you determining it is not working?
    This was also answered in my first post #1

    Quote Originally Posted by Judgeless View Post
    When I try to use the variable control it has zero effect. What is the best way to use this torch?
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveO View Post
    ~ What are your 4T settings?
    I half answered in my first post.

    Quote Originally Posted by Judgeless View Post
    On my 210EXT it will not let me select 4T mode when this torched is plugged in. It does let me select 4T with the default Everlast torch. If I changed the hidden menu (D8) to 1 it lets me select 4T.
    Once I force it to 4T the settings are the 201EXT are pre flow .5, start AMPS 10, up slope 0, welding AMPS 100, down slope 1, end AMPS 10, post flow 5

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveO View Post
    ~ IIRC, it will not allow the torch to control the amps below the start (or end?) current?
    I assume that is common knowledge. I will answer it for you.

    The start and end AMPS are 10. The Welding AMPS are 100. That is a huge difference and you should see it while welding.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveO View Post
    ~ YOU have tried it while welding correct?
    Yes

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveO View Post
    ~ Don't look at the machine, look at the arc. Does the intensity change?
    I do not see it while welding. Should the display change or not?

  14. #14

    Default

    Judgeless,

    Many of your answers are non answers...Regarding the 2T function with the torch, this is a non answer. I didn't ask you how you "assumed" or "expected" it worked. I asked you to verify that it DID work. You make too many assumptions...either that or your reading comprehension and problem solving skills are way off the norm. I don't mean to make fun of that if they are, but several people have pm'd me about that very possibility on your behalf. The way this works, if you have a problem, I ask the questions, you answer them as fully as you can without extraneous information or opinion, and then I come up with a possible solution...THEN and only then, if you have questions ask them... Asking them in the middle of a diagnosis process does not do anything but hamper the process.

    So you understand, as an Electrical Engineer, who would normally be thought to be routinely involved in problem solving....You asked me if it was the torch or the unit to begin with. How do I know? Take a WAG? No, I ask you a series of questions that will define how the unit/torch is behaving. Intrinsic to this particular question is determining if the torch is working in 2T with the amp control. If it does not then the probability is increased that it is the torch.

    Also I asked you to determine what you see with your eyes from the arc. Whether or not it displays on the unit is immaterial as to whether or not the unit is functioning by increasing and decreasing the amps. I asked you to use a real live test and tell me what you see, not something where you are staring a display. A display may or may not be linked to what is happening at the arc. I never (and no one I know of) looks at the display while welding to determine if they are getting any change in heat or the arc. The display is for bystanders in this situation. If the amps change fine, but that doesn't even mean the arc is putting out anything or changing up or down...and vice versa...especially since it's a moot point while involved in the actual weld process. On most units it does change to read actual output, but I've never had reason to verify if this unit does or not. Perhaps later today, I'll get a chance to check to see if it does. If it welds, and changes regardless of what the display does dynamically or statically, I'm good and so would a lot of other people be fine with it.

    The reason you have the background menu is to alter the way the unit works with 2T/4T control for different types of controls as I have told you before. With an amp control that has the switch built into the travel action, where no separate switch is needed, a basic 2T is all that is needed. It's because you roll the amps and the switch is linked to the mechanical action of the unit, whether it's a foot pedal or a CK rotary or slider switch. 4T function will not work this type of control, so 4T is disabled in the normal mode that would be used for a foot pedal or a similar operating amptrol torch.

  15. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by performance View Post
    Regarding the 2T function with the torch, this is a non answer. I didn't ask you how you "assumed" or "expected" it worked. I asked you to verify that it DID work.
    I did answer that. I did not try it because it seems very awkward. Since then I did try it in 2T mode and it does change the current. It is extremely awkward.

    You show a pic using your index finger holding the button and changing the current with your middle finger. Here is a pic of me trying that. That is not possible unless you practice for a long time.



    You also show a pic using your thumb on the button and using your index finger to change the current. That works a little better but it is still very awkward.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_mIQuP5wAQ

    The way that makes the most sense is 4T mode. You press the button to start the arc and then use your thumb to change the current. This does not work.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZ6L6v-eFpM

    When I plug this torch in my Everlast 210EXT 4T is not an option. You have to go to the hidden menu and change D8 to 1. When that happens I cannot control the current.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_oxCFvddlg

    In 2T the only two things you can control is pre flow and post flow. Start Current, Up Slope, Down Slop and End Current do not function.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clLqDrgrXFA

    Are you telling me my 210EXT will not work in 4T mode using this variable current torch? I have to use 2T mode?

    I would have posted all the videos in preview mode but this forum only allows on per post.

  16. #16

    Default

    1)
    I am asking again to clarify, Are you looking at the meter while welding to determine lack of amp control? Or are you just rolling the knob up and down and looking at the meter to determine this as you demonstrate in the video? Or are you ignoring the meter and looking only at the arc while actually having the arc on and welding?
    2)
    The video of you holding the torch like depicted in your first video, is NOT what I posted. Go back and look again. My hand is under the torch. Some grasp overhanded, or underhanded depending on position and even welding style. This is a basic torch holding technique...If Lincoln did not teach you this, then I suggest you apply for a refund. Welding IS ALL about practice and things being awkward, and getting used to it or managing the best you can, and NOTHING is about being comfortable or ideal.

    3)
    When you plug your unit in, 4T is not an option? It is. But you just have to plug the unit in and select it's availability from the drop down. The unit has 5 wires...it uses all five whether it's a foot pedal or a torch switch with a potentiometer located in the handle. A foot pedal is the standard method of use for most people...so this is why it is an option.
    4) 2T function with the torch plugged in with the potentiometer amp control should not feature slope and would start from whatever minimum amp setting the respective process offers...just like a foot pedal.

    5) I've said this many times, not everyone can make a TIG welder. It's an elite art form of welding....some people can learn it well enough to be "finger painters", some not even that, they never get beyond the stickman stage, but very few become a DaVinci or a Rembrandt. Many highly experienced welders with years under their belts fail at TIG welding or avoid it because it takes a different skill set than they are gifted with. Or to borrow from the auto world again, not everyone that tries to drive a car gets a license, a few get a license, but shouldn't be on the road, some can drive an automatic very well, but would crash a manual transmission because of lack of hand/eye coordination. My sister learned on a manual, but to this day still "jerks" the stick and dumps the clutch... and very few of us will ever (successfully) race at 200 mph. Fastest I've been is about 140 in a car around Atlanta back in the oval days at a GM sponsored racing school, and I refuse to say and take the 5th on a motor cycle as it was in my younger and dumber days.

  17. #17

    Default

    And as for telling you the amptrol should not work in 4T, no I have not said either way. I'm still in the process of figuring out what is going on with you and your unit. Operator error has not been ruled out at this point.

    My unit works amps up and down in 4T, but as such, you are having difficulty to such an extent it is hard to tell what you know, and what you don't know and what you are doing and not doing correctly as you've kind of evaded an non answered many of my questions, then over on WW "predict" that English is not my first language. Well, maybe not, I am from the South. We all don't never no how tu talk good or spel. Went to kollage thogh...longer than I care to think.

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