ARGON and ARGON/CO2 TANK SIZES

[performance]

Steve,
What the problem is, is that there have been lawsuits between the companies over this very thing. The major companies pretty much agreed to disagree on the issue. SOME of these companies WILL fill the smaller ones because they aren't their major market. They still are likely stolen. The big bottle business was what was the major problem. Its their core market. They can live with losses of the small units and do turn a blind eye to it. They have all settled to allow the smaller ones to be filled, though technically its NOT their property.

[Steve]

Steve,
What the problem is, is that there have been lawsuits between the companies over this very thing. The major companies pretty much agreed to disagree on the issue. SOME of these companies WILL fill the smaller ones because they aren't their major market. They still are likely stolen. The big bottle business was what was the major problem. Its their core market. They can live with losses of the small units and do turn a blind eye to it. They have all settled to allow the smaller ones to be filled, though technically its NOT their property.

Mark, I am at a loss to figure out why you think they are stolen. Maybe it's me....but this guy is a business man and has been doing this for many years. I'm sure that if he was doing anything illegal, then he would have been caught by now. As I said, he is a friend of a friend and they vouch for him. I saw receipts.
His business is buying and selling used welding equipment and tanks. He even has a store.

I guess anything you buy on E-bay or Craigslist could be likely stolen. E-bay is loaded with small tanks. Using your logic, all small tanks are probably stolen at one time or another.

I was just at Valley gas today and they told me that they sell unmarked 250 cft tanks still. The marked rental tanks have a plastic collar around them now a days and have a UPC code on them to track them better.

We will have to agree to disagree on this. I just hope our little discussion gave some information to others that can be used.

Sorry to the original poster for hijacking the thread.

[Jason]

If there is no name on the tanks, that would mean they are perfectly ok? Is that what you are saying? I have been thinking about picking up a couple tanks from my girlfriends grandfather but would like to know that I will be ok. What should I look for on the tanks other than a rental marking?

[SeanMurphy265]

I think anytime you buy a used cylinder you take a chance on buying a stolen tank. Tanks always walk away from job sites, plant shut downs etc. A local paper mill where I grew up provided all welding gases during their shutdowns. I know people who unloaded old tanks for new ones, and not to mention nobody checked. People would probably return the tanks, but they would get caught. The company my dad worked for gave a $25.00 reward for returned tanks. Sometimes scrap collectors would bring them in thinking they could sell them back, they did not know the company owned the bottles.

[sschefer]

You all need to just rent your tanks. I bought my first two thinking I was smart but then found out I wanted bigger tanks. I have an account at AirGas so they let me trade my tanks in for rentals at no loss. If you buy them off eBay you that won't happen.

Now if I want to go bigger or smaller I just go get the tank I want. My 99.999 250 helium is a rental only tank anyway. The other thing is the testing that needs to be done and what happens if you buy a tank and it won't test sat.. You end up buying another new tank. If it's a rental you never have to worry about that. My two 250's run me 29.00 a month through AirGas. I pay for the gas up front.

Just my .02

[jakeru]

Steve - glad to see you back on the forum. Hope you stay for a while. And I hope to hear an update on your ambitious aluminum boat project as well, when you are ready to give it.

I must say, all the issues you have stated regarding owner/customer-owned cylinders, are not issues at all where I live, with my local welding supplier. I can totally see these practices varying from one area of the country and perhaps even from one supplier in a locale to another in the same locale. But, here is how the one I use operates:

* They will gladly take an "internet tank" or one that they did not sell you, as an exchange. Even if the tank is not a common size.
* They will gladly substitute a larger tank, charging you the difference in their price they sell the tanks for.
* They will gladly substitute a smaller tank, giving you a credit for the difference in the price they sell the tanks for.
* They don't look at any numbers on the tank at all (at least not when you are down there, doing the tank exchange with them), such as to verify the tank you give them for a current hydro test.

No problems swapping to different gas types, either.

Now I will say it wouldn't be realistic to expect to be able to take advantage of their lenient policies repeatedly, but I think they reason they operate like that is to keep you buying your refills from them. They are happy to keep you as a customer.

Out of everything they sell, gas refills are their single highest profit margin business, according to the manager. Other consumables (like filler rod) next highest, machine sales lowest margin.

[everlastsupport]

I'm going through some rough times right now, seeing Steve back on the forum brought a big smile to my face. Steve, any boat pictures..

On the tanks. I will admit that I have bought 2 or 3 rentals in the process of buying tanks, that is not too bad. There's a date on the tank you have to check (10 year hydro test I think it is), sometimes a letter (think they said it was an A) and a ring as well that help check them. Prax makes it look like a mystery sometimes, Welder Services normally just swaps me. I will see if I can get them to give me "the what to look for list" and post it.

Most tanks under 200 are considered owner tanks anyway to Prax/AirGas, WSI, or treated that way. I did OK on all mine, but it does take a lot of time to get a bunch of good ones.

Steve rental is a safe easy way to go. However, if you are on a tight budget, or cheap like me and willing to put in more time to save some cash. I only have one 250 rental, all others are mine (bwhahaha).. Local shops in trouble and Craiglist are two good places to look. And as stated, be prepared to get tanks that were/are owned by places that are no longer around to fill them unless you stay under 150 size. Call your LWS and check on the smaller ones, but works that way here.