New Power Tig 200DX HF question

I was able to get the plug wired and fired up the new Tig. Will need to get use to torch and pedal. I've been using a Lincoln PT 185 Tig that a friend let me use. I've had his machine longer than I am comfortable with, that has led me to purchase my own machine. The arc on the Everlast PT 200DX is really nice and easy to control. The one question I have, the HF start is odd to me, but it may be me. To get and arc started, I have to touch the workpiece then pull away. Tried moving the switch to the (lift) and no change. Moved the switch back to the HF position and could still not get an arc started without first touching the work piece. I do not need to do that process with the PT 185 to start an arc. Is it a common behavior for a Transformer machine to have to touch the work piece to get an arc, am I doing something wrong, or do I not have the machine set correctly?

I'll take some shots of the beads next time I practice, pretty nice machine, can't wait to get use to it :)

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Originally Posted by willida

I was able to get the plug wired and fired up the new Tig. Will need to get use to torch and pedal. I've been using a Lincoln PT 185 Tig that a friend let me use. I've had his machine longer than I am comfortable with, that has led me to purchase my own machine. The arc on the Everlast PT 200DX is really nice and easy to control. The one question I have, the HF start is odd to me, but it may be me. To get and arc started, I have to touch the workpiece then pull away. Tried moving the switch to the (lift) and no change. Moved the switch back to the HF position and could still not get an arc started without first touching the work piece. I do not need to do that process with the PT 185 to start an arc. Is it a common behavior for a Transformer machine to have to touch the work piece to get an arc, am I doing something wrong, or do I not have the machine set correctly?

I'll take some shots of the beads next time I practice, pretty nice machine, can't wait to get use to it :)

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LooK in between the slats on the front panel when you try to start the arc in HF. See a blue electrical light and hear a slight buzz? If so that is your HF. IF you are getting a spark and no arc at the tungsten, then you probably need to adjust your point gap. IF you do not, then you could still need to adjust your point or there is a wire off inside. Point gap is .035 typically. A few thousandths can make a difference sometimes in starting efficiency.

And make sure you are either pushing the button your your torch or pushing the pedal. Just by putting the torch by the metal, won't start the arc.

What is the pre flow knob set at, Try setting it at zero and see if it starts. If not hold the torch away from the workpiece and listen for the HF points making noise. If they are making noise the HF is working. Make sure the ground is good also.

Thanks for all the info, I will give them a try. My gut is the HF isn't working.
CBMKR: yes, I was using the button, and then tried the pedal, both reacting the same way. I hear the solenoid for the argon and I hear the argon flowing so I know their is argon at the torch.
Performance: what you mentioned was what I was thinking the issue was, but also felt it may be the operator as well :)

Thanks again for the info.

To check the point gap, do I need to take the front panel off, or rear panel?

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Originally Posted by willida

To check the point gap, do I need to take the front panel off, or rear panel?

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Give tech support a call and they will walk you through it. There is a new design, but AFAIK you still get the cover off by taking off the rear panel. It will be nice when they totally convert over to solid state HF. Points getting out of adjustment during shipping seems to be one of the number one issues.

Right now there are no immediate plans to convert everything over to solid state. Don't want a rumor started we can't deliver on.

Also, I'd say as was already mentioned, turn your preflow down just to make sure it isn't the gas flow that is delaying the start.

Thanks Mark, I will try that tonight.

If that doesn't work I'll give a call into tech support tomorrow when I can be by the machine.

Turned out, it was the HF unit. Ray was a big help. The unit was missing the nut that held the wires onto the points.

I wasn't overly thrilled to have to open the machine, but, waiting for a nut to come from California made no sense and din't want ot have to wait longer to be able to use the machine.

Didn't have a bunch of time, but was able to check and make sure the HF was working.

The 200DX is a really nice machine, very first time I've done aluminum.
Attachment 8832

Thanks for your patience Ray!!

Hmmm! It does not seem like these machines are tested before they leave California!

No, as we tell customers they are tested in the factory, usually while we are there during production.
We do not tell people they are tested in California. The points are new and manufacturing is getting greased in the groove now on the installation of them, I believe. But we'll address these things like this (if they are a problem) shortly and directly in a few days.

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Originally Posted by performance

No, as we tell customers they are tested in the factory, usually while we are there during production.
We do not tell people they are tested in California. The points are new and manufacturing is getting greased in the groove now on the installation of them, I believe. But we'll address these things like this (if they are a problem) shortly and directly in a few days.

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Over Here in Aussie,
The Guys here at Everlast,TED and BOB re Test everything before Shipping and Leave THE plugs on so they are already Pre Wired.
I Take my hat off to them as they are very thorough

Is it that difficult to fire up a machine before it goes to a customer? This way most will get machines working from the get go, being proactive will with your business, IMHO.

How do I know if the point gap is not perfectly set on my machine? Is it one of those things that it either works or it does not? Also if it is slightly off will it show on the operation of the machine? Have never tig welded before or use any other machine, how will I know if the gap is set correctly?

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Originally Posted by vicrc

Is it that difficult to fire up a machine before it goes to a customer? This way most will get machines working from the get go, being proactive will with your business, IMHO.

How do I know if the point gap is not perfectly set on my machine? Is it one of those things that it either works or it does not? Also if it is slightly off will it show on the operation of the machine? Have never tig welded before or use any other machine, how will I know if the gap is set correctly?

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It would take setting up a place to do the testing, along with unboxing and reboxing. Form other posts it sounds like they are often reshipped right from clearing customs after import, so it might not be that practical. Also I expect that the real damage comes not from riding on a boat in a huge shipping container, but from UPS tossing things around. So testing here would not likely help much.

The only way you will know if the point gap is set right is to measure it. It will have to be off pretty good to be able to see it in the arc starts. Point adjustment is a standard TIG thing and lots of machines have the instructions for that in the manual. Older transformer machines often had a little door just to access the points, because they often used them continuously on AC, not just for starting. With only starting you will probably never need to adjust them, unless the machine gets a banged around, so they don't need the easy access anymore.

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Originally Posted by Rambozo

It would take setting up a place to do the testing, along with unboxing and reboxing. Form other posts it sounds like they are often reshipped right from clearing customs after import, so it might not be that practical. Also I expect that the real damage comes not from riding on a boat in a huge shipping container, but from UPS tossing things around. So testing here would not likely help much.

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This is correct, and this time of year is normally the worse (Holidays).

And with two guys on the truck now, one is fresh and can throw it a lot further (sorry, could not resist, a joke). I truly hope they are doing a good job.

It is possible to ship a few hundred in a day. It takes about 30-45 minutes to unbox, hook up, properly test live (not to mention load bank) and rebox a unit properly to ship...then people complain their boxes were open. We get complaints even now that the torches were tested or fired (at the factory) before they are received and even people insisting we send them a " new" one. Add a couple of hundred dollars to your unit and we'll be glad to personally test it. That's the kind of cost that you are dealing with...because it requires massive amounts of man power to do all this that would be wasted. Maybe that is why Miller charges 400.00 more for the essentially same spool gun? BUT... They are tested individually in the factory live and also tested in on a load bank. We've posted pictures of this process. Duncan has discussed this in a thread. We improved the factory side testing and they are ever working on making improvements to production...Other countries do not have the same volume that we do and have a different structure so they may be able to perform testing before they are sent out.l

Just want to clearify my situation.

Initially, I didn't find the nut anywhere in the unit. Under Ray's instructions, I was able to look through the vents on the front cover to see that there was not a nut on the terminal for the points. The wire was just sitting on teh lug.

Ray was very clear on what to do to get the cover off to so I could inspect it better. While pulling off the cover, I heard something drop to the floor of the unit. Turned out, that was the washer, but the nut was no where to be found.

Ray offered to send a new nut, but since I already had the unit appart, made no sense for him to send. I had a nut in my collection. After setting the points @ .030 I started putting the machine back together. At some point I heard something hit the floor, but didn't see anything. Finished buttoning up the machine and tested and the HF worked fine.

After sweeping up the shop, I found the original nut, so that is what fell out while I was putting it back together.

So long story short, all the parts where there, I'm sure the unit was tested or it never would have left the facility if the HF wasn't working. I'm sure it just rattled off during the UPS cruise across country.

Some one mentioned "You get what you pay for" well personally, the PT 200DX is hands down a better machine than the Lincoln PT 185 I was using.

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Originally Posted by Scotty1

Over Here in Aussie,
The Guys here at Everlast,TED and BOB re Test everything before Shipping and Leave THE plugs on so they are already Pre Wired.
I Take my hat off to them as they are very thorough

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I BET THEY ship a lot less units than we do in the US.

Duncan (Canada) does as well and he ship a lot of units. My hat is off to him.. But for us, we can not based on volume.

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Leave THE plugs on so they are already Pre Wired.

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The plugs that come in the box with North American LX225s are kind of a running joke. It's the right plug for about half the current one of these consume, and I think even the everlast manual says to toss it out. :)

Duncan runs an amazingly good service for us Canucks. I can't say enough good things.

I have not seen any of those type in use here in the US, But i noticed about a month ago looking at some electrical items a friend had for sale, He had a case of 100 cords about 6 foot long with the same end on them.
Have no idea were they were being shipped and what the application would be here in the US unless a US manufacture was installing them on a product that was being shipped to Asia.

It's a US plug, just really, really old and specialized.

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Originally Posted by Rambozo

It's a US plug, just really, really old and specialized.

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It's a plug for Window Unit AC...mostly. It's dual voltage in fact.

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Originally Posted by performance

It's a plug for Window Unit AC...mostly. It's dual voltage in fact.

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It's also used on really old restaurant equipment, back before they required a ground pin.