2013 200DX 240 Volt Version First Impressions

After a few hours of playing with the New model 200DX i am impressed, ( I had my Son In Law under a hood also first time tig welder ) Had a little setback with the pre flow knob set to high ( Mark Set me straight on that) Tried some passes on 11 ga Aluminum The machine had a very smooth and stable arc, Had to set the heat lower than i was used to with the 185, 95 amps was too hot with the 200DX settled on 75 amps and it did well. We tried some .095 Mild Steel tubing for exhaust and settled on around 65 amps. I also tried some .025 and .030 aluminum with the pulse setting and had good success keeping warpage to a minimum on the thinner sheet. I will have a little more time in tomorrow afternoon to try some more applications and see how the 200DX performs.

So far it's a Great Machine.

Did I read correctly that you were using this DC machine on aluminum? How did it do? I'm new to tig, and thought you had to use AC for Aluminum.

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Originally Posted by Gwaltnak

Did I read correctly that you were using this DC machine on aluminum? How did it do? I'm new to tig, and thought you had to use AC for Aluminum.

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The 200DX is an AC/DC machine.

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Originally Posted by Gwaltnak

Did I read correctly that you were using this DC machine on aluminum? How did it do? I'm new to tig, and thought you had to use AC for Aluminum.

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I doubt he used DC for alum. I just don't think he mentioned that he changed the setting over to AC since it is an AC/DC machine.

Sorry i did not mention it , AC for Aluminum and DC for Steel, I did change over the stick holder to a Tweco as this is all i have used for 40 years. I have some stick work to do this weekend and will post the results on that ,weather permitting .

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Originally Posted by cbmkr

Sorry i did not mention it , AC for Aluminum and DC for Steel, I did change over the stick holder to a Tweco as this is all i have used for 40 years. I have some stick work to do this weekend and will post the results on that ,weather permitting .

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Which Tweco, I can't get used to the screw type clamp myself either. Have you found a brand you prefer over others?

Tweco A-532 rod holder , has the different angles along with straight.

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Originally Posted by Trip59

Which Tweco, I can't get used to the screw type clamp myself either. Have you found a brand you prefer over others?

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Sadder but wiser voice of experience: I got what I paid for when I went cheap online and bought a stinger. It has the angled slots that cbmkr mentions but the jaws don't actually touch, and there's enough of a gap that I'm not sure it would hold a 1/16" rod, for instance. I was so annoyed with it I didn't even attempt to install it. So it may be worthwhile to go with a name or at least hold the thing before you buy.

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Originally Posted by DaveO

Sadder but wiser voice of experience: I got what I paid for when I went cheap online and bought a stinger. It has the angled slots that cbmkr mentions but the jaws don't actually touch, and there's enough of a gap that I'm not sure it would hold a 1/16" rod, for instance. I was so annoyed with it I didn't even attempt to install it. So it may be worthwhile to go with a name or at least hold the thing before you buy.

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I was looking at the one TSC has, I think one is a 250A and one is higher rated, they're Hobart and felt very well built. Just figured I'd ask as all the ones I've used previously were stock models from Lincoln and Miller a decade and a half ago or more. Wasn't sure what else was out there, I just know I'm not a fan of the one I have, just can't get used to it.

Lenco makes the best economy minded stingers. As good as Tweco in my book but cheaper. Their 200 amp stinger fits perfectly in my hand.

Just tried a couple of different rods on a piece of scrap in the flat position and in vertical up, 6011 1/8" 85 amps and 7018 3/32" 70 amps, both had easy starting and a nice smooth arc. This is quite a step up from the old 1977 Miller Thunderbolt i have.
The 7018 had the flux lifting at the end of a 5" bead as i finished. Going to make longer ground and stinger cables for my need, probably a 20'-25' stinger and 15'-20' ground.

I have never tried stick welding with my 200DX, you have any pictures you can share with stick welding with your machine?

Here are a couple of pics , nothing pretty just playing with scrap, some 7018 3/32 at 75 amps up hilll and flat. Some 6011 1/8" same amps flat. These rods need dried they have been laying on a shelf for a couple of years.

Had a dirty piece of 1/4" aluminum did some outside corner inside corner and a little flat until the material got too hot. Settled out around 125 amps on AC for the 1/4".

Attachment 8675Attachment 8676

Ok, I am a little confused here. The 200DX has a max of a 1/4" aluminum per spec and your only using 125 amps on 1/4"? Am I missing something here. Note I have zero experience welding aluminum.

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Originally Posted by Odyknuck

Ok, I am a little confused here. The 200DX has a max of a 1/4" aluminum per spec and your only using 125 amps on 1/4"? Am I missing something here. Note I have zero experience welding aluminum.

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The power required for welding aluminum is a function of the heat dissipation. For little pieces like that you don't need a lot of power. Just like for large castings, even with 1/4" thick sections you can need 300 amps or better to get a good weld without preheating. The published spec is just a baseline for typical conditions. 1 amp per .001" is considered the average requirement. With AC balance you can push that a little since you don't need to run 50%. So the 200DX is rated to 1/4" even though it doesn't make 250 amps. Just like fuel economy, YMMV.

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Originally Posted by Rambozo

The power required for welding aluminum is a function of the heat dissipation. For little pieces like that you don't need a lot of power. Just like for large castings, even with 1/4" thick sections you can need 300 amps or better to get a good weld without preheating. The published spec is just a baseline for typical conditions. 1 amp per .001" is considered the average requirement. With AC balance you can push that a little since you don't need to run 50%. So the 200DX is rated to 1/4" even though it doesn't make 250 amps. Just like fuel economy, YMMV.

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It does seem like some of the welding specifications are like fuel economy, just typically welders tend to work in our favor.

I second what Rambozo said just add that the specifications are typically built off of a single pass for the material thickness. But a single pass on something larger than 3/8 inch is impractical unless it is some type of submerged arc from my experience.

Yes and this can change a little if you use 100% Argon or 100% Co2 or argon Co2 mixes and then a little Helium mix changes thing again or the size of wire to thickness of steel, aluminum or grade of material to many variables or as Rambozo put it as a good start is baseline 1 amp per .001" on most material but aluminum alloys change alot on types of welders and now with welding advancements as Advanced Squarewave, Soft Squarewave,Sinewave and Triangle Wave with AC balance and in AC Frequency with Independent AC EP-EN or EN-EP then comes the type of Tungstens that change things again. Welding is so much fun. I learn new things weekly some times daily every day it changes like yesterday I welded 1/4 armor plate.

Kempy,

You won't be welding TIG if you use so much as a smidgeon of CO2. It jsut ain't gonna happen.

So I understand I could weld 3/8" aluminum with the 200DX if I pre heat the material? I ask because I am in the process of deciding on buying a TIG machine. I am down to the 200DX and the 250EX. I do not want to find myself with a machine that is under powered. At this point I do not know if I will ever need to weld 1/2" thick aluminum however would be nice if needed and I had the proper welder. Decisions, decisions!

My understanding (please someone with more experience chime in and correct me if I'm wrong) is that the thickness ratings on most welders are for "one pass" welding. Meaning the 200DX should be able to do 3/8" Aluminum with one pass. If you go any thicker you'll need to do multiple passes.

Like I said...I very well could be wrong but that is my understanding of all the "suggested thickness" ratings.

So happens i was working on a fence bracket for a machine in the wood shop and was adding a 3/8" flat to a piece of 3/8" x 3" flat bar. 200DX was flawless heated up quick made short work of the weld. 160 amps 15cf gas 1/8" 4043 filler. Maybe Mark or someone can shed some light on the thickness rating. But as far as i am concerned for what i am doing it will be just fine on 3/8"

Attachment 8714.

If your even thinking 1/2" aluminum, I would go for the 250EX.

I was only thinking 1/8" and thinner material and settled on the 200DX because it had some features that I wanted that would work with thinner stuff like pulse, it just so happen I wanted to make some slightly heavy tooling stuff and did some 1/4" plates and machine did excellent.

Yeah its not bad on 3/8 , surprised you only need 160A (maybe because your close to the edge?) I was at 200A and I thought my fingers were going to melt. But once the aluminum got warmed up, finishing up the welds on 3/8 is pretty easy.

I don't know how long we can run a bead at full 200A before the machine thermals (overheat)? Also is it bad to thermal the machine?

I also wonder if there is a benefit of using 1/8 tungsten from 3/32?

200amps is 60% duty cycle, thermal overload is bad. Preheat a little with a torch for the thick stuff, not a big deal; Prop with a piece of wood, a TIG finger or some other insulator and go to work. I like to prop up a large work piece on an insulating material(I've got some asbestos bricks, shh, don't tell anyone), so there's less heat loss via metal to metal contact and ground directly using copper cable instead of the table. S/F.....Ken M

I'm looking at some heavy castings that need repair, I'm just planning to bake them before welding, partly to drive out any oils, but also to get a nice even preheat. Preheat helps expand the range of your welder (I have a 200DX as well) and makes welding a bit easier and runs lower amperages. You can go a step further for heavy AL and stack your deck, as it were, by running a higher He to Ar ratio. The helium will give you the same effect as a bigger welder and more amps, with quite a few benefits as well.

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Originally Posted by cbmkr

So happens i was working on a fence bracket for a machine in the wood shop and was adding a 3/8" flat to a piece of 3/8" x 3" flat bar. 200DX was flawless heated up quick made short work of the weld. 160 amps 15cf gas 1/8" 4043 filler. Maybe Mark or someone can shed some light on the thickness rating. But as far as i am concerned for what i am doing it will be just fine on 3/8"

Attachment 8714.

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Not bad, but this is likely what what "did in" your WP17. The thickness of the materials being welded is one important factor for how much power you'll need to weld them; but other important factors (not so easy to describe in a welding machine's specifications) are the overall size and mass of the weldment, and where on it it's being welded. These important factors affect how quickly the heat that is input by the welding arc is being dissipated.

You should upgrade to a CK Trimline 210 with superflex cable if you're going to be welding any more of that kind of thickness aluminum. It looks like you already figured out to minimize for your machine (down to 30% EP) your A/C balance setting, but if not, that may allow you to eek out a bit more metal melting power yet from your setup.

If you continue to weld with your WP17, you should drape the power cable over your shoulder, and stop welding when you feel it getting warm.

I have been using the new style 26 torch that came with the machine after we found the problem with the 17, I also just finished repairing the WP-17 Euro style torch this morning and have tested it and set it on the shelf for emergency use only.

Thanks for correction I guess I should have said in general the new style weld work different then old ones with Tig gases and Mig gases.

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Originally Posted by performance

Kempy,

You won't be welding TIG if you use so much as a smidgeon of CO2. It jsut ain't gonna happen.

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