I-MIG 200 intermittent shutoff issue (green warning light)

The last week or so I've been replacing a whole bunch of floor sheetmetal in a '63 Saab 95 (wagon). My I-MIG has thrown then green warning icon 4 or 5 times and stops welding. the wirefeed still works. The first few times it happened the machine had been on for quite a while, but the last time it happened about 10 minutes after I turned it on.

I'm not running super hot (something like 320-350ipm @ 18.5v max, less for the most part) and there's a lot of downtime. occasionally I might be exceeding the duty cycle in a one minute span, but never in a 10 minute span. My machine has had a lot of idle hours on it, though. For reference I'm at the end of 10# .030" spool number 3 on this machine.

It's also gotten cold and damp the last week or so.
to the best of my knowledge we've never lost power while it was on and we've had no appreciable power surges. It's never been run on a generator (although, I made a line filter to run it off a generator, though. still needs an enclosure.)

It works fine if you power cycle the machine and I haven't had it happen twice in one day yet. it does seem like it welds better after you power cycle it that immediately before it cuts out, but it's hard to tell because it's always been a minute or two before I get back to welding.

I called Oleg the other day while the light was tripped, but it was busy. (no big deal, I was just thinking it would be good to have the machine in the error state for diagnostics). I'll be on location today, but I'll try to call again on thursday if the forum doesn't turn up an answer.

Thanks in advance, guys.

That is your duty cycle light. It will resume welding right and the light will go out without having to cycle it? It will also turn red if there is a overcurrent. I have one of the original MIGs so they may have changed the way that light works as far as what color indicates.

The duty cycle is only about 35 percent at 160 amps on that unit...Depending on your wire diameter and things it could cause it to go into overheat.
If it goes out after a minute or two, and returns to welding it is probably the duty cycle light. If not, it is the O/C or O/V that is the problem.

Edit: Maybe I should explain that light is a dual color LED.

That's usually where I run mine more or less with .030, but about 3/4 wire speed. I have tripped the duty cycle more than once.
I have had a lot of guys say that they weren't welding all that long...Then I challenged them to put a timer on themselves...OOOPS!
When you are welding you loose perception of time.
For example, did you realize that for a small 3.32 rod, it will take you over a minute to burn?

Don't call Oleg when you have an issue...You'll just get passed to one of us.:confused:

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Originally Posted by ogorir

The last week or so I've been replacing a whole bunch of floor sheetmetal in a '63 Saab 95 (wagon). My I-MIG has thrown then green warning icon 4 or 5 times and stops welding. the wirefeed still works. The first few times it happened the machine had been on for quite a while, but the last time it happened about 10 minutes after I turned it on.

I'm not running super hot (something like 320-350ipm @ 18.5v max, less for the most part) and there's a lot of downtime. occasionally I might be exceeding the duty cycle in a one minute span, but never in a 10 minute span. My machine has had a lot of idle hours on it, though. For reference I'm at the end of 10# .030" spool number 3 on this machine.

It's also gotten cold and damp the last week or so.
to the best of my knowledge we've never lost power while it was on and we've had no appreciable power surges. It's never been run on a generator (although, I made a line filter to run it off a generator, though. still needs an enclosure.)

It works fine if you power cycle the machine and I haven't had it happen twice in one day yet. it does seem like it welds better after you power cycle it that immediately before it cuts out, but it's hard to tell because it's always been a minute or two before I get back to welding.

I called Oleg the other day while the light was tripped, but it was busy. (no big deal, I was just thinking it would be good to have the machine in the error state for diagnostics). I'll be on location today, but I'll try to call again on thursday if the forum doesn't turn up an answer.

Thanks in advance, guys.

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My 250p does that if I let the wire touch my work as I pull the trigger. In other words if the wire is touching my work when the trigger is pulled I get an instant green light and no arc... wire still feeds and gas still flows but no arc until I power cycle the machine. it's no problem once your aware of the cause. The welder works perfectly, I guess it's just the difference between inverters and transformers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by performance

That is your duty cycle light. It will resume welding right and the light will go out without having to cycle it? It will also turn red if there is a overcurrent. I have one of the original MIGs so they may have changed the way that light works as far as what color indicates.

The duty cycle is only about 35 percent at 160 amps on that unit...Depending on your wire diameter and things it could cause it to go into overheat.
If it goes out after a minute or two, and returns to welding it is probably the duty cycle light. If not, it is the O/C or O/V that is the problem.

Edit: Maybe I should explain that light is a dual color LED.

That's usually where I run mine more or less with .030, but about 3/4 wire speed. I have tripped the duty cycle more than once.
I have had a lot of guys say that they weren't welding all that long...Then I challenged them to put a timer on themselves...OOOPS!
When you are welding you loose perception of time.
For example, did you realize that for a small 3.32 rod, it will take you over a minute to burn?

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the last time there was no way I was over duty, I'm doing plug welds and the machine was only on for 5 minutes.

I'm willing to believe that the other times I just wasn't paying attention. I'm just wondering if the stop/start nature of plug welding is tripping the duty cycle warning? do you know what exactly it's measuring to determine a fault condition? time trigger is depressed, average current, temperature probe?

I was using the pre-flow (bumping the trigger) to put out burning undercoating on the underside of the existing floor, if that makes a difference.

I don't know if it will cycle back on in time. I let it sit for 5 minutes or so the first time it happened and power cycled it as the fan output in the front was ice cold. (it was 45-50 degrees out here the last week or so save for today and yesterday). I'll let it sit for a good long while next time it happens. I guess I should measure my wirespeed again and mark the duty cycle points on the dial.

Definitely you will heat it up more if you are bumping the trigger. You have a sudden inrush of amps and a lot higher operating temperatures.. But if the light did not go off, then it is not a duty cycle issue because on the MIGs, the light will come on, and then go back off and welding will resume without having to cycle the switch. If the light goes off, pull the trigger and resume welding.

If it is the duty cycle light that is activating, it is controlled by a heat sensor on the heat sink. There is no time or complicated mathematical formula that figures it. When the unit gets hot, no matter what you are doing, and it reaches the point where the heat switch senses it has had enough, then it will trip.

Plug welds, if there is a lot of filling to do, can create a higher heat.

I have had a similar issue running on 110v, but have never had any issue running on 220v.

From what I understand 110v reduces the duty cycle?

Yes it can, and it reduces output.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by performance

Definitely you will heat it up more if you are bumping the trigger. You have a sudden inrush of amps and a lot higher operating temperatures.. But if the light did not go off, then it is not a duty cycle issue because on the MIGs, the light will come on, and then go back off and welding will resume without having to cycle the switch. If the light goes off, pull the trigger and resume welding.

If it is the duty cycle light that is activating, it is controlled by a heat sensor on the heat sink. There is no time or complicated mathematical formula that figures it. When the unit gets hot, no matter what you are doing, and it reaches the point where the heat switch senses it has had enough, then it will trip.

Plug welds, if there is a lot of filling to do, can create a higher heat.

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ok, I'll pay closer attention to whether the light goes off tomorrow(presuming it comes on), have plenty more plug welds to do (spring perches are completely rotten, as well as the shock mount reinforcement on one side)

I'll pull the cover and give it a good blowing off, too. could just be dust reducing the efficiency of the heat sink. I've used it similarly earlier in the year with no issues(during summer even, @ 105f outside)

Update:

I'm still having issues with the machine cutting out w/ the green warning indicator. it happens more often if the machine has been on and idle for a while than when you first turn it on. it also seems to be worsened by humidity (still haven't taken the covers all off and given it a thorough clean, so it could really just be dust. haven't had time. I did give it a good blow through the front and rear vents and what I could with the side panel lifted)

The green light does NOT turn off once it comes on, it will only go out if you turn the machine off. I left it there for an hour to satisfy curiosity.

I think I legitimately tripped the duty cycle once or twice doing some longer welds on 1/8" for a push bumper, but I let it stand for 6 or 7 minutes (after 2 minutes or so of welding, 6" of weld in 3-2" segments)

I also have had it trip on me on the first tack weld of the day. power cycle, then it works fine.


I still need to do a heavy duty cleaning, but if that doesn't clear it up, I'm pretty sure I have a board that's starting to go wonky.

I just happened to have a customer with report this issue this week. After going over it with him, he was contacting the metal when he pulled the trigger. It seems this will cause the overcurrent. On my original unit this will happen as well, but it will turn red and not reset. After he figured out what was going wrong, he no longer had the problem. Mine is different as it was one of the first two produced...and a couple of minor things changed, along with the direction you turn the arc force control knob. Mine has done that before, but in the hands of another guy who was doing the same thing when he was tacking, he was just holding the wire in the puddle.
Clean your unit up and let us know what happens. Have you checked your input current by the way? Is there any chance it is on the low side? If the voltage is on the low side, the inrush current will be higher, and could cause this, if operating conditions are borderline on the gun end as well.

I'll keep an eye on the spatter buildup, then, and see if that's a factor on when it trips. I can't say I was paying close enough attention to say one way or the other right now.

Spatter can bridge inside the nozzle. I do know that, and have experienced it myself, particularly overhead. I use a wider one that I bought from HF that allows more space inside for easier cleaning. If the nozzle bridges to the diffuser inside, or gets pretty close, it definitely will do that, especially if the nozzle touches the metal when you start. Make sure your wire isn't on the weld when you start, by clipping the end when before you restart, if it is a little on the long side, with a pair of mig pliers...

Maybe your extension cord is too long or the wire is too thin, causing the overheating.

50' of 8ga SEOOW should be fine in that regard, thanks for the suggestion though.

I think mark may have nailed it with the spatter bridging between the cup and the contact tip. all it takes is one good sized BB to fall off and wedge down there, then bump the cup into the workpiece or what have you.

yeah, no doubt.

Mark is talking about the one on the right in this link.

http://www.harborfreight.com/2-piece...kit-96360.html

We use both, but my son is always tapping the nozzle to get spatter out. Have not have the IMIG-200 short yet. But we spend some time cleaning out the nozzle.

I don't know squat about mig, but by my understanding, the cup is just channeling the shield gas, correct? Seems like a non-conductive cup or cup lip would be a good solution. I was thinking ceramic, but that would be brittle and subject to breakage if you weren't careful.

Ian

Mig pliers are shaped like a reamer, with sharp edges, for that purpose.. they work good.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Haywire

I don't know squat about mig, but by my understanding, the cup is just channeling the shield gas, correct? Seems like a non-conductive cup or cup lip would be a good solution. I was thinking ceramic, but that would be brittle and subject to breakage if you weren't careful.

Ian

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If the nozzle or wire is touching your work when you pull the trigger, the warning light will come on and the machine will not operate until you power cycle it (turn it off then back on). The nozzle on my new profax torch is insulated as is the miller torch that came with my hobart welder.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by everlastsupport

Mark is talking about the one on the right in this link.

http://www.harborfreight.com/2-piece...kit-96360.html

We use both, but my son is always tapping the nozzle to get spatter out. Have not have the IMIG-200 short yet. But we spend some time cleaning out the nozzle.

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Mike,
That's the one.

Thanks for all this information, I think it has solved a problem that I thought I was having with my Millermatic. Only on this machine the wire stops feeding. if I had good stick out, I would put the wire right against the work piece to insure I would be starting in the right place, I could always see just a tiny spark when I touched it. Mine is a transformer based welder so it's not just the inverters that do it. I was always dumbfounded why it would act like it overheated after just a few tacks or inches of weld on a 40 degree day and other time it would weld on it's highest settings longer than I could. I am glad you are all willing to share your experiences on issues that seem like they should be common sense. (especially without the berating comments)