I was wondering if anyone here has any experience with these units good or bad. I am thinking I would like to get one for general fabrications. Let me know what you think.
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I was wondering if anyone here has any experience with these units good or bad. I am thinking I would like to get one for general fabrications. Let me know what you think.
I have a shoptask 3 in 1. It is sort of ok. I am going to replace the bearings in it with better beatings as they are a bit of a lower quality and have some play even after adjusting them.
As long as you are only doing small stuff and don't have to hit .0005 tolerances, it should work out for you. They are a bit under powered, but can work well to make bushings, mill something flat, damn nice drill press, weld preps, etc.
John
Although I dont have a 3 in 1 lathe, I have read that they can be a pain to use unless you are just making the occasional project. Switching between the lathe and mill is slow. In my opinion, you are better off with separate units.
This machine from micro-mark got good reviews for having a brushless DC motor
http://www.micromark.com/MicroLux-7x...athe,9615.html
...altho it is not a combination unit. Just out of curiosity, what sort of items are you thinking to fabricate?
A good machinist friend of mine has referred to H.F machines as "kits." As in you pretty much have to take the whole thing apart and rebuild it to get reasonable tolerances out of it. And, yes, they are miserably underpowered. Remember the Yugo? Like that! You might want to look at the Grizzly line of combo machines. They seem to look a little bit better to me. But you get what you pay for. Personally I think combo machines are nothing but compromise after compromise and not worth the money. You might check eBay for used mills and lathes. I have acquired several Leblond, South Bend, and Bridgeport machines that way and been satisfies. Yes, they're monsters, but they do great work.
I have both a lathe and vertical mill and have had good luck with both of them. I have had the lathe since last august and have used the heck out of it and it comes back for more.
I have turned down for free, many lathes and mills, all too big, all take up too much space. That being said;
Nothing wrong with the HF that can't be fixed. A couple of shims, a little deburring, use calipers instead of their built in markings, and it will be fine.
I have a Smithy LTD, similar to their Grizzly. The LTD has two motors, one for lathe one for mill so set up is just changing the holding device.
Something neglected as a feature on 3in1's is that the head of the mill will swing away from the bed. Thus, you can set something really damn big on the floor, swing the head, and mill a slot or cut a dovetail or wahtever. The mill head on mine is nowhere near stable enough to cut much more than almuminum and hdpe.
They are fine for projects, easy to learn on, and are cost/space effective. I can take the shellac off of a pepsi can just by doing a handchuck and a manual runout. I have no idea how thick the laquer on one of those cans is, but I can turn the can end to end and leave the ink on it. I once used the lathe to do a plastic weld to extend a rod. Friction weld, lathe turning some of the stock other end held firm and manually released at just the right time.
Buy the HF or better the LTD or if it's for small projects get a sherline.
The 'kit' analogy was perfect. Those with no talent will call them junk, those with talent or a want to learn, will call them a kit.
Be forewarned; The mill/lathe is the smallest of your expenses. Tooling and jigs and millheads and collets and all the good joy that comes with sundries will eat your lunch money.
Thanks John, I think I can be happy with .001 tolerance making bushings, milling surfaces, slotting material, drilling precise holes and making weld preps is the type of work I would like to be able to do. I guess if they are underpowered I will have to take a smaller cut and make more passes.I think I can live with that. Good luck with your bearing change over I hope it works out for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by sportbike
Thanks duckface, I not too worried about the kit idea of building the machine up and I can add tooling as I go but I am concerned about the milling head not being stable enough to mill steel. I am sure at sometime I will want to face a piece of steel or slot a piece of 1/4" plate steel. Do you think this is beyond the ability of this type of machine or just slow and tedious?Quote:
Originally Posted by ducksface
As far as the combo machines go this one is said to be one of the better small machines.
http://www.grizzly.com/products/Comb...tachment/G0516
Another plus from Grizzly is their USA service and parts support.
Thurmond
For now it will be just the occasional project. I would like to get separate units but price and space is another part of the equation that I will have to weigh out. Ideally I would get a machine that had the ability to do many things with some set up and change over as long as the machine did not have anything that it just could not do. I've got plenty of time to decide. Thank you for your opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by welderdude
Thanks Dave,I would like to be able to fabricate wood lathe turning tools and jigs also larger shop projects for metal fabrication where I would need the mill. I checked out the micromart website and that looks like a nice lathe although it is smaller than what I am hoping to get.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveO
I don't mind a bit of kit work, but I do like power. The grizzly combo unit 9729 looks just like the HF44142 one exept for the paint.I just can,t fit a moster in the shop. Thanks for your thoughts you got me thinking and thats a good thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidShearer
Salty
Just a bit over a year ago I was in the same spot. Do your homework. Go to machinist and hobby machinist forums and ask around.
It seems weight is a big factor in the rigidity of the machine and also in reducing chatter when cutting. Next look toward the future and get a machine or machines that will just do more then you ever think you will be doing, trust me on that.
After doing all I mentioned above I decided to buy a lathe first and got the HF 12x36 It does all I need and has room for so much more. I then (6 months later) started looking for a dovetail column mill drill. I ended up finding a Grizzly 4084 in Atlanta for a great price used and only 6 months old.
The most important thing I learned was what an old time retired machinist told me about machining. Expect to spend at least what the machine costs in tooling I spent more on tooling and tools, indicators, mics, etc then both machines cost, quite a bit more. so be ready for that.
Good luck and I hope this helps
It sure helped me make the right decision and I am glad I listened.
Ray
It does steel well enough, i just don't have the patience. I have done steel before; you just can't ram a mill into the side of a block of steel and not expect some deflection. part of it is laziness on my part and not using the correct speed. If I locked everything down tightly I imagine it would work just fine. The head shaft on the mill extension is probably 4 inches around so on second thought; the deflections may be my fault for hurrying. It will face steel just fine, it's a dovetail I was thinking of when i wrote the first description.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty
The lathe is great and has a 'passthrough' hole in the center of the chuck that lets you chuck up any length that is less than 1 inch in diameter. I did an 18inch bore once on my little Smithy. I think 12" is the biggest diameter I have turned, and I have a built-in half-nut for cutting threads, but have never had a reason to not just use a tap or die.
I paid $1700 at a yard sale for mine with a stand and Kennedy top and bottom FULL of tooling. It was new except for an expert setup. It's probably my favorite thing in the garage.
The cheap magnetic lights at HF are my friend. I have three of them that move anywhere, I have a track [4]light mounted on the wall behind the unit, and a magnifying lamp on a stalk. STILL not enough light for me.
Go to the yahoo group site and look up 3in1 mills. There is a great grizzly/Smithy group that I used to haunt.
I highly recommend a 3in1, HF or not, as a viable tool and a fun learning toy. I never make much on mine; a fitting, a spacer, a slot, a brace, an O-ring groove, but it is very nice to have around, and very satisfying to work with. I can be up and running something is just minutes.
I took a 1/4 inch off the inside of a plastic bracket just last night, re-spaced the holes for the u-bolt, and trimmed the bigger part of the mount by about an inch, on a taper. Took 30 minutes to make my foxwing awning look purposefully mounted instead of cobbled onto my roof rack.
Which ones did you get model etc.. and what kind of work are you doing with them?Quote:
Originally Posted by welderdude
Thanks Thurmond, I am looking for something in the 12"swing 24"between centers range. I have a grizzly band saw ,drill press and table saw all good machines with good service.I have been looking at their machines but HF prices are alot better for what looks like the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tritium
Salty,
I have the grizzly G0463 mill with a DRO I installed and a G0602 lathe. People talk about them being junk etc. After owning these chinese machines for some time now (3 years)you realize the accuracy is in the operator, not the machine, the machine has the ability to just make accuracy easier to obtain. I too looked long and hard at the Smithy type machines and kept being warned off by the various machinist sites. The truth is, they were right. You save some money but ultimately loose functionality. It was a much better idea going the individual machine route. As to tooling, holy crap! You don't know what a black hole is until you start trying to tool up for even the most basics of functionality, and it is mind boggling what is available! It is very easy to become a tool whore...
http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t...1/DSCN1081.jpg
http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t...1/DSCN1078.jpg
Thanks Ray, this sounds like good advice I will look at some of those sites. It sounds like you made some good choices when it was time to decide.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ram48
Thanks for the quick reply duckface, I appreciate the detailed explanation it definitely will help with my decision.It sound like you got a great deal with your purchase.
Thanks for the info and the pics Zoomie, that looks like a nice setup. Just so you know if you guys are trying to scare me about the cost of tooling its starting to work.:P
Don't be scared, jump right in! There are lots of gadgets out there (I've got plenty). If you can't see yourself using the tool/gadget at least once each project forget it, you can probably either make one, buy one used or utilize a different method to arrive at the same result. Buy a good vice, good set of parallels, good hold down kit, good dial calipers a wiggler set, a center finder, set of end mills (HSS), fractional drill bit set, a set of R8 collets or a taper that'll fit your machine (not the 21 piece set) the small set. a good drill chuck, a magnetic indicator holder (cheapo chinese) dial indicator (cheapo chinese)that reads .001, a copy of Machinery;'s handbook (used older version off ebay) High speed steel tool blanks sized for your lathe's toolpost, a drill chuck with morse taper for your lathe tailstock, and a dead center and you're rockin! I'm sure others will think of stuff but this will get you started enough to start learning. I'm not a machinist nor pretend to be one but looking back this is what I should've started with...
Thanks again Zoomie,this looks like a good starter list. I know where I can start with tooling now. All I need to do now is decide which machine or machines to buy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoomie
One source for tooling I use for the smaller lathes and mills is http://www.littlemachineshop.com
Good guys there (at least in my experience).
Thurmond