Next Shipment Due When`

Morgaj,
I understand your sentiment, but sales increasing as they are, its hard to argue with the figures. We may put a few off, but most would seem not to be.
But ANYONE in shipping internationally, will tell you, as has been affirmed here before by others that have, it is impossible to give exact dates. We have established the forum as a form of communication with the customer and we keep things updated here. We sponsor a forum on WW for further access to communication and we have email, as well as a multi man, tech support department.

More service cost more. We will be glad to sell our product at a higher price to support more support, but it seems that customers are fairly satisfied with what they get now at the price they get.

Mark,
I contacted sales several days ago via e-mail concerning the shipment. Oleg responded and said he would look into it. After a couple of days I sent an e-mail to Oleg with the tracking numbers provided by UPS. No response. So, I called on Monday and spoke to someone in sales. They took my personal cell number since I am currently on travel. They indicated that a supervisior would contact me. No calls to date. I PM'ed my contact information to Oleg with my work e-mail since I have 24/7 connectivity with the Blackberry. Still no response from Sales. The only response to this is from Service! The best service department can't keep a company afloat if the front end sales department can't keep the customer informed. I know that Everlast is a growing company. Just seems that the ordering process needs to be looked at and with more information forwarded to customers. Especially the one's who have prepaid for their orders $2,000 for an order that has been billed to a credit card a month before the machine gets on shore. I also know that global supply and just in time delivery is modus operandi these days.

1. Amateur's study tactics, professionals study logistics.
2. A battle is decided before the first shot by the logistics.

Why not get one of these instead, on single phase it is just about as good as your EX 250

http://www.millerwelds.com/products/tig/dynasty_350/

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Originally Posted by worntorn

Why not get one of these instead, on single phase it is just about as good as your EX 250

http://www.millerwelds.com/products/tig/dynasty_350/

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Not a good idea, I went with the EX 250 and have the extra $8,000 in my pocket, much better feeling when you have saved money in your pocket.

that's what I was thinking too.

Joe mentioned that for a few bucks more he could have had a Lincoln and been welding in three days. I haven't looked up the retail on an Invertec that would have similar ratings to the EX 250, but my guess is it would be similar in cost to the Miller, what with them being close competitors.

For about 50% more than an EX 250 & cooler costs, my friend Murray brought home a new PT 185 Lincoln, but no cooler at that price.
The good news is it doesn't need one because it's a gutless wonder!
With a 15% duty cycle @ 185 amps it is only capable of welding 3/16" aluminum with lots of rest breaks at that. I use this machine all the time (the Lincoln PT 185) and it is fine on thin-wall material, but really just a toy compared to the EX 250 or my PP 256.

Actually, on DC the Lincoln is a toy even when compared to my little $800 PU 205 , (60% @200 on the 205) which really irritates Murray, especially when I point out that it also has a 50 amp plasma in there.



If you want serious power in a new North American machine you have to spend some serious money!

Usually people are comparing apples and oranges when they make "comparisons" like this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by worntorn

Why not get one of these instead, on single phase it is just about as good as your EX 250

http://www.millerwelds.com/products/tig/dynasty_350/

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worntorn,
After placing my order I did find a Miller 350DX on craigslist and another poster had the coolmate V3 w/WP18. The total package would have been $2.8K. I know there is difference between the two welders.

Now, it time for me to eat a little CROW. I did receive an e-mail to my home account from Katya at 8:00PM EST that the cooler and cart would ship at a later time. Didn't do much good since I was on the road. However, didn't say that they were still enroute to the U.S. Didn't get this information when I called on Tuesday either. So, seems the basic problem is lack of clear communications between all parties.

And the rest of the story. Unpacked the 250EX, not a scratch on the carton even. Was a little shift in the regulator and it had punctured the box it was in. Wired it up and energized. All functions worked. Set it up for SMAW and worked fine up to 200A. Set it up for TIG and works great up to the 100A max that I was confortable using without the cooler. Welded some steel and Al. Really out of practice after 21 years not holding a TIG torch. The Euro torch just doesn't feel right. May have to get used to it or switch to a plain WP18. The only problem is the fool pedal. There is a screw that didn't seat all the way and the pedal doesn't sit level and rocks. The screw is stripped but it will be not problem to correct.

Bigjoe - If you want to do a quick and dirty test of TIG in watercooled mode, you could adapt a garden hose, or threaded laundry tub faucet to supply the necessary water pressure for the watercooled torch. Set the coolant return line so it drains into the laundry tub, or out onto your lawn or garden, etc.

Joe, I think that is apples to oranges once again. You are comparing prices on a used no warranty buyer beware Craigslist purchase to a new with 5 year warranty purchase.

and isn't it a bit scary that a $10,500 welder package is only worth 2800 bucks used?

Worntorn,
The welder in questions was from a local authorized Miller & Lincoln repair center. The original owner went out of business and he got the welder as a settlement for the lien on the business. It was to cover the repair bill on the welder. So, at least he was breaking even or a little profit from selling it.

As for the garden hose. I will just play around for awhile with the reduced amps until the cooler gets in. Always get the feel back on thinner stuff anyway. This is the first time for Alum TIG. The AC and puddle flow is something to get used to.

BigJoe,

Worntorn is right, the hose will let you test the unit. I still have two torches setup that way. I have a nice bernard cooler now I do not even turn on much as quick jobs (like TIG repairs) quicker to run a hose in and screw it on.

It does work. But if you have a nice cart for both machine and cooler, I understand the wait for the cooler.

Aluminum can be a pain, look for dull and shiny change over the red glow like you do steel and it will come to you fast.

I'm just sayin new for new amps for amps it's 2 grand versus 10+ or thereabouts, not "a few dollars more"

I understand you are annoyed with Everlast over shipment time, but comparing prices on something in the used market to someone providing a new product isn't fair game.

Glen

I also ordered a 250 ex and there was a long wait, but rather than put down any money, I waited and watched this thread for the arrival of the boat and ordered not long after Bigjoe reported he had a shipping notice. My welder shipped and arrived when I was told it would.

It is unfortunate that Bigjoe and others have had long waits and it seems unfair to take the money without acknowledgement that the items are not in stock. In the future if there is not a discount for a pre-order, then at least knowing the item is in stock when you pay for it would not be unreasonable to ask. I have had some experience with overseas importers before and checked the forums first to see what was happening with other orders, but many folks may not.

On a bright note, I just got my plug on and have run a stick weld and also a DC TIG weld on some scrap without a footpedal, just to make sure it was not DOA. It has worked OK for the first five minutes! :) Much more testing to be done.

So far, I do wish that the Everlast crew would consider putting a print copy of their online manual in the welder package. Things would have gone a bit smoother getting started than with the horrific "Chingrish" manual. :P

I always download and thoroughly read the online manual BEFORE I even make a purchase. ;)

Thurmond

Will,
You may not be aware, but we do tell customers they are out of stock and usually give discounts for preorders, unless its a day when a lot of orders come in and we go out of stock sometime during the day or before shipping is completed. We do take care of inventory counts, but some days, you think you have several weeks of stock left, then, you have nothing by the end of the day...and need more.

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Originally Posted by Tritium

I always download and thoroughly read the online manual BEFORE I even make a purchase. ;)

Thurmond

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I do that on anything I order from the internet as well BEFORE I buy. Like the DSO Quad I bought months ago. I always read the manual before I order. Technology, got to love it.

Will should have read the forum here and would see why we still have the manual in the box. Much as I wish it was not and have wished for years. Also, Will could have called tech support for help.

I myself have gotten two guys up today (Saturday), will not name names. Both wired the plug wrong.

Mark, I understand these things happen. I am not making a big deal out of it, but it seems a little notification would go a long way to prevent some frustration like BigJoe has gone through, especially since he waited a long time and had another delay in his cart and cooler.

It didn't stop me from ordering! One reason I did order is because there are some lines of communication in place and owner/employee involvement in this forum. My welder testing continues! Footpedal, spot timer, and pulser sections are working. Only thing left is to check the AC welding, but I need rods!

I didn't need any phone tech support, all the answers were on the forum and found via search. I got it right the first time. I just meant it would be nice to have the nice manual for others that aren't as internet savvy.

Everlast Products are hardly accessible without being internet savvy? Not for me anyway. Consider yourself extremely lucky if you have a local store where you can go. (I know there are a VERY few)

Thurmond

I got a considerable discount by preordering and I imagine everyone else does too. The discount was not available once the items came into stock or even a week before, so it made sense to preorder and wait.

Aside from the savings, it is clear that models such as the EX 250 and PP 256 are selling very fast, so the stock doesn't seem to hang around long once the boat comes in. By preordering I had a good chance of getting one on the next boat, which is what happened. Unfortunately the coolers did not come in with welders.

So I don't see a big problem with preordering and enjoying the savings knowing that there is a long distance, ocean shipment dependant, somewhat unpredictable waiting period involved.

IMO, if Everlast would add great communication to the current line of great products, I think sales would double or triple.

That's sort of where we are now in growth.

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Originally Posted by morgaj1

IMO, if Everlast would add great communication to the current line of great products, I think sales would double or triple.

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I had 2 tech calls yesterday (Saturday) and one today (Sunday) and Mark is watching the forums, and I know Ray is buried on work. Mine were phone calls to the office so I think we can communicate fine.

We can not keep up with our sales now (so double our sales will help right?), the problems you are probably talking about is on the order/deliver side. If we raised our prices a little we could handle the inventory load better? But people buy from us based on price and what they see online, some come here and vent. If you ask them to pay more they would rather wait. But they still like to use the tech forum to vent. And we discount a lot on pre-orders which kills the next inventory faster as well.

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Originally Posted by everlastsupport

I had 2 tech calls yesterday (Saturday) and one today (Sunday) and Mark is watching the forums, and I know Ray is buried on work. Mine were phone calls to the office so I think we can communicate fine.

We can not keep up with our sales now (so double our sales will help right?), the problems you are probably talking about is on the order/deliver side. If we raised our prices a little we could handle the inventory load better? But people buy from us based on price and what they see online, some come here and vent. If you ask them to pay more they would rather wait. But they still like to use the tech forum to vent. And we discount a lot on pre-orders which kills the next inventory faster as well.

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Mike, Too bad more businesses don't have the problem of all their product sold before it even lands in port. :cool: Good for the business but sometimes frustrating :mad: for the customer who expects instant gratification. It is all the fast food industries fault. They were first to deliver instant gratification.;)

Thurmond

Quote:

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Originally Posted by everlastsupport

I had 2 tech calls yesterday (Saturday) and one today (Sunday) and Mark is watching the forums, and I know Ray is buried on work. Mine were phone calls to the office so I think we can communicate fine.

We can not keep up with our sales now (so double our sales will help right?), the problems you are probably talking about is on the order/deliver side. If we raised our prices a little we could handle the inventory load better? But people buy from us based on price and what they see online, some come here and vent. If you ask them to pay more they would rather wait. But they still like to use the tech forum to vent. And we discount a lot on pre-orders which kills the next inventory faster as well.

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Mike, I don't understand your sarcasm. If you read my posts on this topic, they have been constructive. I have worked for many, many years in an industry that strongly linked with customer service. I am simply trying to offer suggestions to help. Instead of actually listening to what your customers are saying, you respond arrogantly. If you guys have it all figured out, then why do you still have folks on here complaining of poor communication? I believe a dose of humility would do you guys some good.

Knowing Mike as I do, I don't think he was being sarcastic, but rather he is giving the facts as he sees them and it is in direct response to the issue you raised. He is giving the reason why communication is slow at times...people aren't willing to pay more for more service. As we have pointed out before, each of us are multitasking our talents in the company, and we are doing an increasing amount with what we have as resources. To add more service, at the bottom line, costs more. There's not a more humble crowd around, than these guys. Each and every guy busts their rear for the company and puts in long and hard hours. The problem is, that there is always someone that you aren't going to be good enough for. Its reality, that we will please some people, but not all. We hear constantly we have been communicating, but its never enough. We make improvements, but they aren't fast enough. We add more staff, but its never enough. We take calls during business hours, but its never long enough. We listen to the customers, but its never long enough. We service our product, but its never quick enough. We have close to 30,000 total customers now... Want to talk about the time we put in at 10 o clock at night returning calls to customers? Ray's calls at 5 am in the morning? My calls at 10 am Sunday morning. Sunday night at 9 pm, Saturday all day long as well? Each guy expecting me to answer his call when he calls in personally, not expecting me to be on the phone with another customer, when he calls? None of this is "paid for" but we do it anyway, off our business hours because we do go the extra mile. Proud and arrogant people don't pick up the phone off hours or try so hard to please everyone, even though we won't be able to.

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Originally Posted by Tritium

Mike, Too bad more businesses don't have the problem of all their product sold before it even lands in port. :cool: Good for the business but sometimes frustrating :mad: for the customer who expects instant gratification. It is all the fast food industries fault. They were first to deliver instant gratification.;)

Thurmond

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:D Never thought of it that way. Yea, we are a smaller shop than the big guys, we don't have 10K employees sitting in the warehouse waiting on Paul Senior to deliver a bike with welding trailer attached.

With us, generally we are ahead of the game, this year, seems we have been behind. For the price, you have to take it like it is. Nothing is hidden here, though the internet would want to to believe different. We do the best we can, and I am just a tech guy. Mark normally tries to keep tabs with the main office. But I know the main office gets slammed, because us tech guys sometime get a rash over it. We check up for the ones that "call" in, but we have no inventory we can ship, just parts.

People need to understand, this is the Everlast international tech forum (though linked off the Everlastwelders.com sales domain), you must have a unit and need help to get anywhere here. Or you can ask questions about the products before you buy, but we will still send them to the sales office.

We do not sell them here in the tech forum. We do have dealers that do. Anyone can call Ray (everlastalaska.com), Duncan (everlastwelders.ca), Bob (everlastwelders.co.uk), and so on and get a price and order. Some people do that. If it comes from the main US office, you need to take it up with them, just like if it came from a dealer.

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Originally Posted by morgaj1

Mike, I don't understand your sarcasm. If you read my posts on this topic, they have been constructive. I have worked for many, many years in an industry that strongly linked with customer service. I am simply trying to offer suggestions to help. Instead of actually listening to what your customers are saying, you respond arrogantly. If you guys have it all figured out, then why do you still have folks on here complaining of poor communication? I believe a dose of humility would do you guys some good.

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I think more welders in stock would do us better myself. But again, based on the price margin, am I repeating myself? It's been this way for a long time. And a few complain. We know the issues, but people do not want higher prices.

If we are out of a model, customers have to wait, that simple. Many agree to a pre-order agreement (and normally get a nice discount), which tech support can not really help with. We are not given customers names, number, order info, CC info..

I wasn't being sarcastic by any means, just stating the simple "facts". You don't even know me, but I would not have been with Everlast for the many years, over 5, if I did not believe in the product. I do not run Everlast either and I have my opinion as well, but for the price people want, this is sometime (sometimes) the way it goes. And the main office dictates how we run sales, not the support forum.

Nothing you have said has not been mentioned over the years, our tech support and it's forum is bar none, one of the best (so no dose of humility applies here on this forum where you are posting). If you want to call the sales office, feel free. I'd rather keep my "Sunday" open to helping people with welding issues.

Thanks Mark and Mike. It helps to "see" into the inner workings of the company. Much of what you have stated is not readily apparent without quite a lot of digging about. Possibly a company fact sheet "sticky" is needed.

Thurmond

I went on the Miller site a couple of weeks ago to ask a question about brush replacement for my Miller/Onan 230 amp. It appears there is no Miller rep on there, or perhaps he is away on holidays. My question eventually was answered by a knowledgeable member of the Forum.

When I ask a question here, one of the Everlast people generally will get to it, maybe not right away. I notice that a lot of their Forum responses come after daytime working hours and on weekends or holidays. That tells you that they are packing a fairly heavy work load. At the same time it is nice to know you can get a response to a question without waiting for Monday 9-5 hours then going onto a long distance phone queue.

The 2 k Everlast welder does what the 10 k Miller does (actually 10% higher duty cycle on single phase), the warranty is 66% longer and I can generally talk to a company rep one way or another when needed.

I'd love it if they would mow my lawn or take out the garbage too once in awhile, all for one low price, but really I think this is enough to expect from a company!

Glen

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Originally Posted by worntorn

I'd love it if they would mow my lawn or take out the garbage too once in awhile, all for one low price, but really I think this is enough to expect from a company!

Glen

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I'm easier than that Glen. All they have to do here is water it. I'll take care of the rest. ;)

Thurmond

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Originally Posted by everlastsupport

Nothing you have said has not been mentioned over the years, our tech support and it's forum is bar none, one of the best (so no dose of humility applies here on this forum where you are posting). If you want to call the sales office, feel free. I'd rather keep my "Sunday" open to helping people with welding issues.

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Mike, keep your Sunday open to help other customers, because you just lost this one. I have tried to offer some suggestions to help your company, but apparently your arrogance will not let you receive this for what it is. I realize that no business is perfect, but you have to listen to your customers if you plan on growing. Based on your previous post, you are not interested in growing. I am very happy with my Everlast PP50, but unfortunately it will be my last Everlast purchase.

Again,
Morgaj,
I think you misunderstand Mikes point. He is trying to tell you that the issue is out of our hands to do more about anything more than we are directly here on the board. Your comments are appreciated, and not lost, but this isn't the place to get changes made. Direct contact through the home office is. We may full well agree with some of your suggestions, but we are not the ones to put it in place, and in many cases we may have made the very same suggestions. We are here to have fun, most of the time,to share a little, teach a little, and learn a little and help a lot. If Mike, Ray or I could affect the change instantly with a magic wand we would....The problem is that you have pointed out things we are ALREADY working on...Another case where things aren't going to happen fast enough for some folks and if doesn't we don't "listen to the customers". It takes capital to do the things you are saying...Perhaps you'd like to comment on where to dig it up? See, again, everything has a cost attached to it. Its well and fine to tell us do thus and thus and your sales will triple, but then, give us information we need to tell us where to dig the capital from to do thus and thus. We have asked customers to give us constructive comments...Not ones that say, HEY, you need to do __________. But rather, you need to do __________ and here is how to accomplish it.

Also, keep in mind Mike and some others may be the very ones you will have to work with someday should you ever have a problem with your cutter. I'd hate for things to be more awkward than they already are.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by morgaj1

Mike, keep your Sunday open to help other customers, because you just lost this one. I have tried to offer some suggestions to help your company, but apparently your arrogance will not let you receive this for what it is. I realize that no business is perfect, but you have to listen to your customers if you plan on growing. Based on your previous post, you are not interested in growing. I am very happy with my Everlast PP50, but unfortunately it will be my last Everlast purchase.

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I'm sarcastic and arrogant now. You have never met me. I have not called you a name, insulted you, simply stated facts. Mark even pointed this out. Again, we have no control over sales, we are tech support here on the forum.

I will repeat my highlights again. We hear this all the time, please call sales with sales complaints, I too have my own opinion (that probably matches yours by the way) however I nor others in tech support run the company.

Can't say it any shorter. If you choose to shop elsewhere, that is probably your loss, I am not sure why you are taking the facts so personal, calling names and will go spend more money elsewhere? But I did my part here and it is your money.

Mark,

Now you know I would help almost anyone, just like you. Plus I wouldn't know who it was. Haha.

I figure we will kill/cleanup the unrelated posts later anyway as they are way off topic, far as Thread: Next Shipment Due When.

Maybe a sticky like Tritium mentioned, about the use of the forum, though I am sure we have it somewhere.

Whoa there fellows. I think we need to shift the rudder and get back on course. This is starting to sound like a college business class discussion on company resources, working capital, corporate tax liabilities, resource loading and some project management. Can I get some credit for reading all of this. I am happy that I finally received the true word that the cart and cooler were on another shipment. Would have been nice to know that when the 250EX was shipped. The 250EX is more welder that what I was used to. However, it will allow me to brush up on what has faded over the past XXX years, expand on the new features of these welder, and learn a new material. The summer heat must be getting to everyone. Sounds like this is something that could be solved by a cold on on the beach watching the sun set discussing Iron Carbide grain growth.

Easy to say, you started it!:D

Yea, All I was wanting to know is when the stuff would ship. Why the coolerl and cart didn't ship, etc. Human nature can really take a turn . . .

Joe, you might want to go back and reread your own posts, there is a lot more than that there. You sound downright angry in some of them. Maybe that was justified, I'm not sure, but it did set the tone.

Worntorn,
I wouldn't call it angry. It takes a lot to get me angry. I just call it not meeting the expectations that were implied during the ordering process. I think that a simple e-mail when the 250EX was shipped that the cooler and cart would be delayed would have been enough for me to manage my expectations.

Worntorn, I agree, I think Big Joe started all this. Just kidding.

Here at Everlast we run a tight ship and have not raised our prices much in years. We have a great price for a great product. Normally things are pretty smooth, but sometimes there's that speed bump you have to slow down for. So timing this time got us and a few that came to the "tech support forum" to post.

Expectations. The saying goes, "you get what you pay for". Well it can apply in a couple ways. With us in a good way with sometimes a delay.

So I bought a welder and the price was great. It sounds too good to be true, I do not have it yet, can't get anyone to personally contact me, etc... We'd have to raise the price for that when we are running behind.

Which would anyone pick. I got the product really fast, they emailed me and it's junk OR there "were" delays, I finally got the product and it's all I expected.

Some shipments, we can not fit everything in the containers. So cart are low priority and coolers come on the next one. We pay the shipping to you either way, you will get the products.

As Mark and I clearly mentioned, we have to work to keep the prices down. And we work very hard at it.