USING FILLER ROD Poll

I want to put this question out here for our Forum users .
When using filler rod for TIG i normally cut the rod in half for better balance .
How many other users out there do this.
The reason i am curious is i want to start putting " packs together
My reasoning is simple . Offer the new Customer a starter pack ( Pack of different sized Tungsten and pack of different sized Stainless , or Aluminum.)
having the filler rod 18" as opposed to 36' makes packaging with unit cheaper. And no difference in shipping cost
I would be interested in hearing Forum users comments on this.
Cheers

18" is best for me. I purchased some from HTP America ( www.usaweld.com ) and they had already cut it to 18" reasoning that most users do it anyway and it makes shipping easier too as you have indicated.

Thurmond

18" filler is alot easier to handle then 36" and would assist "newbie" welders. Some people have it in their heads that you waste rod, but what is an extra inch?

Good idea on the "set up" packs though. What tungstens are u going to supply?

deffinately easier for the 18" but over time you get use to the 36 and an extra inch over time adds up but to most hobbists its not to bad.

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Originally Posted by Velocity

but what is an extra inch?

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Being of Irish ancestry, I can say without a doubt ............................................ Some of us would love an extra inch :O:O

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Originally Posted by Velocity

18" filler is alot easier to handle then 36" and would assist "newbie" welders. Some people have it in their heads that you waste rod, but what is an extra inch?

Good idea on the "set up" packs though. What tungstens are u going to supply?

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We presently stock 2% Ceriated 2% lanthanated and 2% Thoriated from 1.6mm up to 3.2mm
I was thinking of having each type packaged in
2x 1.6mm
3x 2.0mm
3 x 2.4mm
2 x 3.2mm
I do not think we need to carry any other types as this covers the majority
of most peoples needs.
And i was thinking of doing the same with the Filler Rod with
2 grades of Aluminum and 2 of Stainless ( except it would make up 2 lbs of rod ) or something along those lines.
Had some customers in on Friday to try and buy and a couple wanted stainless steel filler that i could not supply.
Praxair is right next door, so you would have thought it would be a no brainer and very simple to pick up what you need. The have a minimum 10lb order for sales so i had to send a couple of customers elsewhere as they did not want to get this much in one size.

Most seem to be using 1.5% lanthanated around here. The two lws stores here stock 1 lb containers of filler, and one of them if they are out will sell you out of a 10 lb box by the pound if need be.

I think most people would be fine with 1/16" and 3/32" 2% lanthanated tugsten with an inverter machine. I have welded 2 razor blades together with a 250 Synchrowave @5 amps with 3/32" tungsten. It wasn't easy to start but got it done by scratch starting because the HF blew out the metal before the arc started.(see leading edge in pic.) Can't wait to try this with a 250 EX. This sounds like it will go over good with customers as long as u can keep the $ at a decent level.
I am working with Oleg to become a dealer in the PA MD area. i also was thinking of this same package and also would like to give some customers that need it, some low cost lessons with purchase of a unit.
Either at their place or mine.

Attachment 3151

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Originally Posted by Velocity

I think most people would be fine with 1/16" and 3/32" 2% lanthanated tugsten with an inverter machine. I have welded 2 razor blades together with a 250 Synchrowave @5 amps with 3/32" tungsten. It wasn't easy to start but got it done by scratch starting because the HF blew out the metal before the arc started.(see leading edge in pic.) Can't wait to try this with a 250 EX. This sounds like it will go over good with customers as long as u can keep the $ at a decent level.
I am working with Oleg to become a dealer in the PA MD area. i also was thinking of this same package and also would like to give some customers that need it, some low cost lessons with purchase of a unit.
Either at their place or mine.

Attachment 3151

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Price is a very important point that needs to be considered but in all honesty i think it is something that we can be very competitiive on. You also need to keep in mind that offering filler rod is not something we expect to make a lot of money on but it is something i would like to offer to our customers. I feel by offering the Variety pacls we are in fact helping our customers in getting started in a fairly cost effective way. This gives them the opportunity to to try a variety of sizes ( and materials if it comes to that ) without putting out as much as they may have to by purchasing individual sizes.
At this time there is very little interest in doing this with other divisions of Everlast nonetheless i will be offering this.

For a small quantity of rod that comes packaged with a machine, 18" rod makes sense because it wouldn't need a bigger box.

But, personally I prefer 36" long filler. Mainly because, it lasts much longer on those large welding projects before it is required to stop welding to reach for another rod.

Most important feature in a filler rod, is that it is provided clean (and not oil contaminated.) Cleaning filler rod that is brand new, seems like such a waste of time. Wiping a new filler rod with a white paper towel, should result in the paper towel remaining white afterwards. I've experienced from dirty aluminum rod before, that was Radnor branded. I will avoid radnor brand rod from here on out.

Some kind of a storage container (to keep rod clean and organized) is also nice, but not a necessity. Rubber banding into bundles is an alternative that may be appropriate for a small quantity included in a machine box. And some permanent alloy identification on the rods (such as alloy number stamped in to the end) is also nice to have.

As for tungsten size, 2.0mm is not a size that is very well supported in the US. 1.6mm (1/16") and 2.4mm (3/32") would cover a lot of ground for most everlast TIG machines. 1/8" may be useful for the larger machines output machines. I almost never use 1/8" tungsten with my 200 amp machine, even for the thickest aluminum I'll use 3/32".

If I could only pick one tungsten type, it would be lanthanated, with slight preference going towards 2% over 1.5%.

1lb aluminum filler rod is about the same number of sticks (and bulk/size), as 2lbs of stainless or mild steel rod, by the way.

I agree with jakeru, 18" would be fine for a 'starter pack' but I always use full rods. nothing sucks more than being in the 'zone' and laying down a good bead (especially on alu) and running out of filler. I bought an old standalone wire feeder that I intend to turn into a tig wire feeder someday to get around the running out of rod and cut ends issues.

having 4- 18" sticks of everything under the sun would be something I'd be interested in buying, even today, even at a premium. the odds that I need a full pound of hast W? 0%, the odds I might need to repair a crack in some difficult cast iron? fairly high.
something like
mild:
70s2 (in .035, 1/16th, and 3/32)
70s3
70s6
one of the higher tensile series 80s-,90s-(I know nothing about them, but I'm sure they'd come in handy at some point.)
4130
4340

stainless
308l
309l (in .035, 1/16th, and 3/32)
316l
347 (high corrosion resistance)

alu
1100 (3/32)
4043 (1/16th, 3/32 and 1/8th)
5356 (1/16th and 3/32)
there's another alu alloy rod that jody has mentioned that I'm forgetting that I'd like to try.

nickel
hast w
ERNiCr3-nickel82 (never used it, but it looks like another good compromise rod for welding nickel alloys together and to SS/mild)

other
aluminum bronze
maybe a ti rod and a copper rod?


I'd probably pay a hundred bucks or so for 2-4 rods of each, just to have around, without having to shell out for a lb of each.

I use 2% lanth when I can get it, but almost no place stocks it. I blame this entirely on jody. I have never had an issue with 1.5%, but his shootout convinced me to try the 2% and it does seem to hold up a bit longer than the 1.5%. I've never welded anything over 175a, so I can't comment on 1/8" tungstens. I probably would stick to 3/32" because the need for me to weld that hot would only come up once in a blue moon. including (1) 1/8" tungsten and collets in your pack might not be a bad idea for that reason, though.

Diamond Ground has the 2%. That is all I have found.

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Originally Posted by ogorir

I use 2% lanth when I can get it, but almost no place stocks it.

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Originally Posted by bigjoeinkg

Diamond Ground has the 2%. That is all I have found.

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I've ordered lots of 2% lanthanated from this guy http://stores.ebay.com/tungstendirect he always has whatever you want.

I dont cut mine down at all and think that it has less waste if you dont cut them down but I do weld better with a shorter rod. I have gotton better with the 36" and can weld fine with it. My problem is I tend to hit things with it when its full length. When I got my tungsten, I didnt see too many options for 2% lanth and ended up just getting 1.5%. I have had no problems with them on Mild Steel, Stainless Steel or Aluminum.

Duncan,
I thing the 18" is a fine idea. While some may prefer longer, the 18" will satisfy all needs as fer as a usable variety pack. I am sure the intent is not for folks to buy the variety pack as a staple, rather just a starter kit.
I see it being useful for multiple reasons, both to provide a variety pack, but also it will enable testing of all of the features of the welder upon receipt, on multiple materials, to ensure it is functioning properly.

I usually cut mine down as well. As previously stated, when working in close quarters often there just isnt room for three feet of wire. Even if I'm on the bench I tend to smack my hood with the end of the wire at full length. If I'm working with very small diameter pipe, I will cut them into thirds and use them until there is about an inch left. I keep some of the ends for making tacks when I have to hold a part in place to tack it. It happens once in a while. Just cut off a tiny bit of filler, lay it on the work and fuse it that way.

I usually cut my filler rod for steel. For aluminum, it goes so fast that I leave it full size.